Episode 23: Adjusting Work Schedules to Prioritize Family with Michelle Risser
Navigating the Complex World of Work-Life Balance
Hey everyone, it’s Ashley here! In our latest episode of Raised to Empower, I had the pleasure of chatting with the incredible Michelle Risser. Michelle, a licensed therapist, consultant, and mother, shared invaluable insights about balancing professional and personal life, especially as a working mom and therapist. We delved deep into the challenges, solutions, and the ever-evolving landscape of our work environments. If you haven’t listened to the episode yet, be sure to check it out! Meanwhile, here’s a rundown of our enlightening conversation.
The Reality of Balancing Work and Family Life
We all know how tough it can be to juggle our demanding careers with equally demanding family lives. Michelle perfectly encapsulated this when she mentioned seeing fewer clients per week than financially ideal, simply to create much-needed space for her family and personal needs. For Michelle, this meant only taking on about 12-13 clients weekly. She emphasized the importance of realizing personal limits to prevent burnout—something I’m sure many of us can relate to!
Flexibility and Diversified Income Streams
One strategy that both Michelle and I advocate is exploring diversified income streams. Michelle and I both had to find alternative ways to financially support ourselves, whether through teaching, writing, or creating workshops. Michelle is even collaborating with Jenny Hughes on a workshop series designed to help therapists diversify their income without needing to start a new business or make a massive initial investment. It’s priced at a very reasonable $97 and covers everything from initial ideas to implementation, plus a bonus on leveraging AI to boost productivity. Trust me, it's worth checking out if you're looking for more financial flexibility!
Embracing Life’s Unexpected Challenges
One of the most poignant parts of our chat was when Michelle opened up about her breast cancer diagnosis just before COVID hit. This unexpected health challenge led her to scale back her therapy sessions and focus more on herself and her health. She was honest and transparent with her clients about her situation, which helped her manage her workload effectively during a tough period. The pandemic, with its relaxed teletherapy protocols and available financial aid, provided some unexpected flexibility that made this transition smoother.
The Shifting Needs of Family Dynamics
Michelle highlighted that as her daughter grew older, the needs changed but didn't necessarily lessen. Her daughter, now a teenager, requires more attention in different ways, particularly with school activities. This was a huge factor for Michelle in deciding to limit her working hours, ending her day at 2 PM to be more available for her daughter. She shared an experience of communicating these necessary changes to her clients, a process that went smoother than she had anticipated, as clients were generally understanding and adaptable.
Personalizing Work-Life Balance
Something Michelle and I both agree on is the importance of personalizing our work-life balance. No two therapists—or people—are the same, and what works for one might not work for another. We need to stop comparing ourselves to others and understand what works best for us personally. For me, balancing therapy sessions with taking care of my children and other obligations has meant dipping my toes into entrepreneurial ventures, much like Michelle. This approach has given both of us the flexibility and peace of mind knowing we have multiple streams of income to rely on.
The Power of Community and Genuine Connections
Michelle emphasized the sustained value of building genuine relationships and networking, even in today’s digital age. Her success in establishing her private practice over 13 years ago relied heavily on good old-fashioned networking. Walking into local businesses and treatment centers with business cards in hand may seem a bit old school, but personal connections can be incredibly powerful. It's a reminder that sometimes the tried and true methods are still relevant.
Final Thoughts
Our discussion was a beautiful illustration of the daily challenges and triumphs many of us face as therapists juggling work and family life. The takeaway? Being honest with ourselves and our clients, acknowledging our personal limits, and cultivating flexibility can make all the difference. If you’re seeking more support or looking for ways to diversify your income, consider joining our community on Facebook and checking out Michelle’s workshop series.
Thank you to Michelle Risser for sharing her journey and wisdom with us. To all our listeners, remember to subscribe to Raised to Empower, leave a 5-star rating, and share the podcast with your therapist peers. Let's continue to support and empower each other!
With love and empowerment, Ashley
Transcript for Episode 23
[00:00:00] Ashley Comegys: You are listening to the Raised to Empower podcast. I'm your host, Ashley Comegys, a licensed clinical social worker with a multi-state online therapy practice. I have a passion for empowering women and mom therapists to break free of the fear, overwhelm, and oppressive systems that hold them back from taking action and building the private practice of their dreams.
[00:00:23] My goal is for you to boldly believe in yourself as a clinician and business owner. If you're looking for a place to learn, practice, building, strategy and skill, while also claiming your own power as a woman and a therapist, then you are in the right place. Welcome to the show. Hey, welcome to this week's episode of the Raise to Empower podcast.
[00:00:46] My guest today is Michelle Risser. She is a licensed therapist, consultant, speaker, and writer. Her clinical focus areas are maternal mental health and trauma, and she is passionate about supporting other [00:01:00] therapists and helping professionals to minimize burnout and embraced their multi-passionate selves.
[00:01:05] Michelle has a lot of hobbies including playing guitar, painting, singing in a choir. Volunteering with the Red Cross, and she recently joined a rowing team. Michelle is the proud mom of a 14 year old daughter, and in the summer she can often be found cheering for her kid on a softball field. Michelle, I'm so excited to get to have you as a guest on the show and, and to just get to chat with you today.
[00:01:29] Michelle Risser: Thank you, Ashley. I'm so excited to be here.
[00:01:33] Ashley Comegys: So I've wanted to have you on the show, I think since I told you I was gonna be doing this podcast and I'm really glad we get to chat today. Michelle and I met, not necessarily like in the therapy world, but therapy adjacent world of additional income streams and entrepreneurship, and we've just created this connection of encouragement and support.
[00:01:55] For one another as we've just been adjusting and [00:02:00] adapting in our own individual lives. So I'm excited for us to have this conversation today and share a little bit about what's been going on with both of us. With everyone.
[00:02:09] Michelle Risser: Absolutely. Sounds great to
[00:02:10] Ashley Comegys: me. So Michelle, I always ask guests to start back at the beginning and share a little bit about how did you get into the world of therapy.
[00:02:21] I know you're a social worker like me. What led to you saying, Hey, I think I wanna go into this field, and then not only in this field, but into private practice.
[00:02:31] Michelle Risser: Private practice. Absolutely. My undergrad was in anthropology. And I'm located in the state of Ohio and my focus area was on Ohio archeology. So I studied the Hopewell culture and I did an archeology internship and I had every intention of being an archeologist.
[00:02:49] Yeah. And then I graduated and I was looking at possibly going into grad school, and I found that the jobs that are available for archeologists many times, unless you get your [00:03:00] PhD and go into academia, They're not Indiana Jones. They are standing on the side of the highway, um, putting dirt into buckets and then taking s dirt back to the lab and sifting it, you know, for $9 an hour.
[00:03:19] Not glamorous, it's, no, it's important, but it is not glamorous. And through that process, I started thinking about, well, I'm inter, I'm very interested in people. I'm interested in human behavior and, you know, I wonder if I could be a counselor. I, I started out thinking about therapy or being a counselor and that way I can help people now as opposed to studying people from the past.
[00:03:45] Sure. That can help people navigate their behavior in the present moment. Yeah. And it led me to social work just because, um, it's somewhere, you know, in this. I think this is true and this message is out there that there are a lot of different things you can do [00:04:00] with social work that you may not be able to do with like a counseling degree.
[00:04:03] You know, you can be a hospital social worker or um, you know, you can get into more grant writing or administration or things like that. Yeah. So I went the social work route. Yeah. And my first job was in agency work. Like so many of our first job, I worked in H I V and aids, and I actually loved that job, but this is where all of us kind of ties together.
[00:04:24] I did that job for four years and it was a, quote unquote nine to five, but it was a salary position where we, we worked far more than that. And my daughter was born and I went back to that job part-time and that's when I started doing therapy. Before that, I had been a case manager, so I was more of a traditional social worker.
[00:04:44] Yeah. And um, I had also been a counselor for the drug and alcohol program. And when my daughter was born, I went back part-time and that's when I started thinking about private practice and I thought, why not? And. I don't know that [00:05:00] anybody would recommend starting their practice the way I did it, but it worked for me.
[00:05:04] Sure. The first thing I did was make business cards and start handing them out and start just telling people, Hey, I'm going to into private practice. I didn't even have a space yet. I didn't have any clients yet. I made business cards and, and I pounded the pavement the old fashioned way, knocking on doors.
[00:05:21] I did find an office, but I could sublet. By the hour from a friend and you know, I'd walk into nail salons or grocery stores Sure. And just say, Hey, if you know anybody looking for therapy, I have a private practice. And that got me started. And I see a lot of people now, you know, suggesting that those things are a waste of time for me.
[00:05:43] Good old fashioned networking and marketing is never a waste of time. Yeah. And I just built slowly and I did take some insurances starting out. And then eventually when I was full enough to justify my own office, I got my own office and that was 13 years ago. Wow.
[00:05:59] Ashley Comegys: Well, and [00:06:00] also networking. Today, I think because of technology, there are not that like pounding the pavement.
[00:06:07] Can't be fruitful, but it does take time and so, yeah. Mm-hmm. Like if you don't have time to do that, there's other ways to quote, unquote pound the pavement, but it be more time efficient for you if you don't have the time to do that. But yes, networking is a people. If you've listened to this podcast, you know I talk about the need to connect with other people.
[00:06:30] Yes. Let them know what you're doing with your work.
[00:06:34] Michelle Risser: Absolutely. And you know, I, I feel like even more so in today's world because everything is so digital and we are so connected to actually, if you can, if you can take the time and actually stop by someone's office that's gonna stand out today. Sure. And one of the things that I did was, um, I, since my.
[00:06:55] Experience was some substance abuse. I would go to treatment centers [00:07:00] and I would take donuts. I would take boxes of donuts for the staff. You're not walking in there asking to speak to the doctor. Sure. You are making friends with the front desk because they are the ones who are the gatekeepers. They're the gatekeepers.
[00:07:12] Yes, yes. And you are going in and you are taking them treats and donuts, and you're telling them just a little bit about what you do. You're handing them a stack of business cards and you're saying, please don't hesitate to reach out if there's anything I can do for you. Yeah. It has to be about what you can do for them.
[00:07:28] And I hear so many people saying, I'm calling doctor's offices and asking for referrals, and I don't know why it's not working. Well, they don't have time to help you build your practice. Sure, sure. You need to help them. So that has worked for me, and I still do that kind of marketing even now. It's all about connection.
[00:07:47] Ashley Comegys: All it is a hundred percent. It's about that connection. It's about that relationship. That's how they get to know you. You're not just a business card. You're a business card. That represents the work that you, as Michelle Risser [00:08:00] do as a licensed clinical social worker because they know who you are. They trust you.
[00:08:04] They have built that relationship with you for sure. That's right. And what do you specialize now currently in your private
[00:08:11] Michelle Risser: practice? I specialize in maternal mental health. I'm certified in E M D R. Um, and I love doing e emdr, r Intensivess, which are longer sessions, more intensive sessions. So my kind of ideal sweet spot would be someone who has been through birth trauma and is looking for intensive mdr.
[00:08:33] Ashley Comegys: So one of the things you and I connected, On a lot the last few months, and I think it's really interesting because if you look at us on paper, there's a lot of similarities, but there's also a lot of differences in where your family is currently versus where my family is. Yet there's a lot of similarities and overlap of needs that we have, and I think that's one of the things I think you and I are hoping [00:09:00] to look at today is that.
[00:09:03] The impact of motherhood, regardless of what stage of motherhood you're in. Mm-hmm. And the impact that that has on your needs in your practice and in your personal life and your family life. So if you're comfortable sharing, like what is kind of your family dynamic currently and what are you finding challenging about that as it relates to having a private practice?
[00:09:31] Michelle Risser: You know, that's how this conversation was born because I was looking at having a teenager versus what, what it's like to have an infant or a small child. And so my daughter, I have just one child. I am married, so there are three of us in our family, and my daughter is 14. She's getting ready to start high school and right now, Her needs, even though she's mostly self-sufficient, a teenager before they're driving, they need a lot of time.
[00:09:59] [00:10:00] I, I'm always driving her somewhere and she has a lot of activity, so a lot more of my life is spent, you know, making sure that she can live her life, driving her somewhere almost every evening or going to her games or, um, you know, just being there for her, taking her places. Yeah, so she doesn't need me to wipe her nose, but you know, she needs a ride.
[00:10:25] And what I have found in a way, so when they're little, especially if you have a child who's in daycare, and I know that's a whole own can of worms, I'm not saying that's easy, trust me. But if they're in daycare, they may be in daycare from eight to five, or maybe they can stay a little bit later. They don't close till six, and you have a little more leeway.
[00:10:46] When they're in middle and high school, they're done with school at three or four o'clock. And one of the other things that changed recently was my daughter no longer had a bus that brought her to the house. They did more of a communal bus stop that I had to drive her to. [00:11:00] Okay. And so I had to end my work day by three 30 at the latest.
[00:11:06] Yeah, and then I started realizing that that was not even cutting it. If, let's say, for example, like tonight I'm doing this call with you and right after this I will need to get home, throw some kind of food at my family. And you know, she has a softball game that she has to be at at five o'clock. So I'm finding that I need to be available for my family earlier and earlier as my daughter gets older, which might be counterintuitive.
[00:11:34] You know, so what you
[00:11:35] might
[00:11:35] Ashley Comegys: build, you wouldn't think that. Yeah.
[00:11:37] Michelle Risser: Right. So I am slowly working my way back till now. I'm done with therapy clients by two o'clock.
[00:11:46] Ashley Comegys: How has that been for you, recognizing one, okay, this is a need that I have. Mm-hmm. And that this is a need that's going to then impact my business.
[00:11:58] Mm-hmm. And how do I [00:12:00] reconcile that?
[00:12:02] Michelle Risser: So there was one turning point. I'll tell you a story. My husband was, I think out of town for work and, and he and I tag team. He, and he helps coach her teams and he does a lot of the driving too. But it's just, it's a lot. It takes really, for a teenager, you need a two to one.
[00:12:20] Yeah. I don't know how, um, single parents do it. Hats off. So anyway, what had happened was husband was outta town. I had clients until three, and then I had a 30 minute. Break, and I had a three 30 to four 30 because that's what my schedule used to be. You know, I'd go till three, I'd take a half hour break, and then I'd see one more client and I'd be done at four 30.
[00:12:42] And what happened was I left at three. I picked my daughter up from school, I brought her back to my office. She changed. Into her softball uniform and my office bathroom, and then she sat out in the waiting room. I saw my client from three 30 to four 30, [00:13:00] and then my daughter and I got fast food and shoved it in our faces as we were speeding across down to try to get to her game and time.
[00:13:07] And I thought, this is not healthy for anyone. It's not good for my client, it's not good for my kid. It's not good for me to be this stressed and this rushed. Um, this is not working. Yeah. And I was really nervous about telling those three 30 clients because I would do 2, 3 30 appointments every week. So I had a good, maybe four clients, four to six that would be affected by this, and I was really nervous.
[00:13:35] Even 13 years of experience, I was still nervous about telling them I'm dropping your time slot. Yeah.
[00:13:41] Ashley Comegys: How did that go?
[00:13:43] Michelle Risser: It went a lot better than I expected. Um, you know, basically I gave them three choices so I can refer you out to someone who has more availability. And I was just transparent about my family's needs have changed.
[00:13:53] Yeah. And from this point on, um, my, my latest regular appointment is going to be one o'clock. [00:14:00] My latest that I can ever possibly do is two o'clock. Yeah. Yeah. I have to be outta my office by three. And, um, I said I can refer you out. If your job has any flexibility and you can see me earlier in the day, that's an option as well.
[00:14:17] If you feel like you're up to a point where you're ready to be finished with therapy, we can have that conversation. And I had a couple people who were ready to be finished. Okay. I had a couple people who situation had also changed. Okay. Believe it or not, they were going to part-time at their job and they were able to adapt.
[00:14:32] And then I had a couple who are able to come during their workday. One needs a note from me, almost like a doctor's excuse. Sure. You know, and I'm happy to provide that. Just all it, all it says is confirming that she had an appointment and it's actually worked out. It's worked
[00:14:48] Ashley Comegys: out just fine. Well, and I think what's interesting about that, I know I have felt this internal struggle and in talking with a lot of.
[00:14:58] Other therapists I think [00:15:00] they have too, where something does change for our needs, right? Something changes for our schedule, and we're afraid of having that conversation with. The client because we have this belief that that's the only time that works for them. But in listening to you, I don't hear you saying the majority of them were like, either I'm ready to discharge or refer me out, but that they are able, if they want to continue to work with you as their therapist mm-hmm.
[00:15:27] They're able to find a way to adjust their schedule and adapt. To fit themselves into the slots that we have available that we don't need to expand into this other time because we think it's what they need. Absolutely.
[00:15:42] Michelle Risser: Yeah. Absolutely. And it helps if we are flexible too with our schedules. You know, if you are a person who's like, I require standing appointments and they have to see me weekly, and this may not work as well.
[00:15:54] Yeah, I have to be flexible. Some people drop down to maybe once a month, [00:16:00] even if they're in a really good spot and they wanna go into maintenance for a little while. Sure. Um, also something that is interesting, um, Is that I have found, when I really sat down and looked at, okay, what schedule honors my needs and my family's needs at this point in my life, and what I have found is that's about 12 to 13 clients a week, which is not what I need to make to reach my financial goals.
[00:16:25] So it has made it imperative that I have other income streams. Yeah. I'm just, I'm not available at this point in my life to have enough appointments to. Make what I need to make. And I, and there's a lot of different ways people address that. That's where some people might raise their rates or, you know, for me, I've handled it by doing other things as well, but I don't have to be scheduled and sitting in my chair to do.
[00:16:48] Yeah.
[00:16:49] Ashley Comegys: Well, and that's one of the things you and I have had a lot of conversations about. Obviously our situations are a bit differently. Just, I have very young children. I have mm-hmm. Five and a half year old, a two [00:17:00] and a half year old, and another one on the way. And the irony is where there's a big age gap between our kids.
[00:17:07] There's a lot of similar needs. And you know, one of the things that we've talked extensively about is just the struggle that it, it is when you are in session. We are in a profession that we cannot be multitasking. You have to be present with your client and there are times when I've told a client, Hey, my child is sick at school.
[00:17:32] I may be getting a phone call, and that's. That's different, right? But when I have the insurance company calling me to try to talk about a claim, I can't put my client on hold to go deal with that about something that's going on with my my family life, right? Like I have to put that on the back burner to deal with when I have time and that the challenge.
[00:17:56] In having really just a life, [00:18:00] whether it's children, and we can get into some of this for you too, whether it's children or parents or adulthood, that when we're in our therapy seat, we are literally just in our therapy seat and we can't be doing more than one thing at a time. And similar to you where you're talking about like, okay, the time changed for you, where now your daughter.
[00:18:22] Has to be picked up at this time because now the bus isn't gonna bring her to here. You know, we're gonna be going into kindergarten this coming year for our son. Mm-hmm. And I don't know why, but school here ends at 1255 on Mondays and 1 55 the rest of the week. And so we're gonna have to do some afterschool childcare, but, The needs of my family are shifting and changing.
[00:18:46] My oldest has some special needs and so he has a lot of extra appointments. There are weeks where we will have five appointments just for him for a variety of different things, and my husband does the best he [00:19:00] can to try to accommodate with his schedule. It's interesting because I have a lot more flexibility with my schedule technically, cuz I work for myself.
[00:19:09] But at the same time, I don't in my day, Like if I get that phone call or if I need to do this at a certain time and I have a client, I don't have that flexibility. So similar to you as I'm approaching maternity leave and looking to what's gonna come when I do return to working with clients, there's gonna definitely have to be an adjustment because the way it's currently structured is not going to work for our family's needs.
[00:19:38] Michelle Risser: Absolutely. And one of the, the first things that had to happen for me was seeing fewer clients in a day. Yeah. So there was a time when I was younger and more fresh in my career at the time too, but when my daughter was in the daycare, you know, and it's interesting, just a little side note, I work with a lot of moms and a lot of them say, oh, I feel so guilty about [00:20:00] putting them in daycare.
[00:20:01] And they're, they're an infant. And I, I usually say in my experience, even though they, they need you for their basic needs. That's the time where you have the most childcare available. Yeah. They need you more when they start kindergarten and you'll see Ashley every other day there's a party, even though they end at 1230, there's parties, there's plays, there's school, you know, just, there's always something that they need you to be at school.
[00:20:28] I feel like they need you more in the school years. Yeah, yeah. At least as part of your time. Yeah, so that was one thing that had to go is I used to see, you know, eight, occasionally, even nine clients in a day. And there is, yeah, it's no way mentally or emotionally I could do that anymore. Sure. But also what you were speaking to nine hours a day where you can't answer a phone call, can't respond to an email, and during the pandemic, The door and there was a time where everybody was just messy and it was like, yeah, [00:21:00] someone's at my door.
[00:21:00] Understood. I'm sorry, my kid's teacher is calling me. You know? Yeah. That was just, we were all a mess. Yeah. During that, but now we're, now we're back to being expected to be somewhat professional.
[00:21:12] Ashley Comegys: Sure. No, but it's true that, you know, that's one of the things. I was thinking about this the other day. When I go to a doctor's appointment, there's times the doctor has to take a phone call or they're charting when they're talking to me or they step out and there's certain doctors I've not gone back to because I'm like, I don't feel like you're paying attention and listening to me.
[00:21:33] But even in that, in that profession, they're able to. Multitask. Right. If they need to step out to look at a lab report for somebody else, they can do that. And it's kind
[00:21:43] Michelle Risser: of acceptable. Not only that, they're with you for 10 minutes. Yes. Yeah. We're with people for 55 minutes to an hour. Yeah. Back to back to back.
[00:21:52] And I've just found as I get older and my family's needs change, I don't have that attention span. [00:22:00] Yeah.
[00:22:01] Ashley Comegys: Anymore. Yeah. Yeah. Well, especially when things are really crazy, right? Mm-hmm. Like I find when I'm. Mentally trying to do the gymnastics of like, how is this person gonna get here? And I have to be done by this point because my husband's just told me he can't pick up the kids, so now I have to be done to get over there.
[00:22:17] And this, the dinner still isn't done right. Like all the things that, yeah, like it's harder when we are split in so many different directions to be in that. Completely focused space. And I think that that then becomes telling of, okay, we've got too much on our plate. I know you do a lot of work with burnout for therapist moms, and I think that's probably one of the signs I, you know, I would guess, and maybe you can speak to that of like, yeah, there's some burnout going on here if you're not able to focus.
[00:22:47] Michelle Risser: Absolutely. Yeah. Well, and that's a fine line too between is there burnout and you're not able to focus? Or is it because this is just beyond your capacity? Yeah, yeah. Are, are you pushing yourself [00:23:00] beyond your capacity to do your best work? And I figured out I'd do my best therapy with 12, 13 clients a week max.
[00:23:07] Yeah. And that number is going down and we Sure. Compare ourselves to others who are like, I see 30 people a week and I do better therapy with fewer clients. Yeah.
[00:23:19] Ashley Comegys: Well, and I'm a better person. I'm a better mom. I'm a better wife. Mm-hmm. When I'm not seeing 30 clients a week because mm-hmm. It's not like I come out of the therapy room and there's no other needs that exist in life.
[00:23:32] Like usually there's right. Some child screaming, I need this, or I want this, or, can you do this with me? And I have to be able to attend to that in some capacity. Or like for you, there's probably somebody being like, I need another ride, right? Like, mm-hmm. Like, I need this thing. There's now this on the calendar.
[00:23:50] And if we don't have the mental or emotional space for that. Yeah. How do we, how do we pivot? I know one of the things that we have in common, [00:24:00] Is in addition to our therapy practice, we do have other entrepreneurial endeavors that we have ventured into as a way to help supplement income. Knowing that, okay, maybe we are having to cut back on the number of therapy clients we're seeing.
[00:24:18] Was there a turning point for you and if you, if there was, what was it to say, I need to move into? Adding an additional income stream besides just my therapy?
[00:24:31] Michelle Risser: Yeah. Actually, the turning point was right before the pandemic, I was diagnosed with breast cancer and I had to start chemo in February of 2020, right when the world was.
[00:24:44] Yeah, getting ready to shut down and everything was on fire and one of the hardest parts of that for me, believe it or not, was being in private practice and having to tell my clients, and I decided the best way to handle that was to be transparent. I thought, I can't be coming [00:25:00] in here, you know, bald or on chemo, and I have to cancel or, and my clients don't know what's going on.
[00:25:06] That just felt not authentic, so I decided to be transparent. And just tell them, here's what's going on. I'd love to continue to work, but I do know I'm gonna have to cut back on my schedule. So I referred out any high needs clients who I felt like I could not meet their needs. Mm-hmm. I referred out any brand new people.
[00:25:27] I pretty much only had maintenance people and that's where, that was where I first started to realize like I'm available. At that time it was more like for eight clients a week, and that's. You know, not going to get me to my financial needs, but at the time for business owners, there was a little bit of help.
[00:25:44] You know, they had those small business loans to get us through Covid, and somehow I got through that. Ok. You know, somehow that worked out. Another thing too, for those of you who out there who take insurance, insurance was very easy during Covid, they pretty much [00:26:00] decided we are not gonna fight you. Right?
[00:26:02] Some of them eliminated deductibles and covid and copays, and you were able to bill your teletherapy and you actually got paid for it without, right. So that that helped. And now they're back to fighting us. Right? Right Now they're back to clawing back money. But anyway, um, And then as once I got through chemo and we were coming to the end of 2020, that's when I realized like I wanna look at other things I can do besides just therapy.
[00:26:27] I had been teaching CEUs for years. Mm-hmm. That was something that I even did in my agency jobs and I've taught at conferences and I decided I wanna become my own C provider. Yeah. And start doing that. And you know, I did a program to teach you how to ethically separate out. Second business and I just started building up on my online income streams.
[00:26:50] And also during that process, because I had a little more time during the pandemic, I got my EMDR certification, which opened the door for me to be able to [00:27:00] start providing consultation as a consultant in training. Yeah. So that opened up another income stream. Something I've realized with that though is that does involve, especially the individual consultation, is that involves one on one.
[00:27:13] And it's really no different than seeing clients as far as my energy output. There's a difference in what we're talking about and and how that goes. But it's still my hour, my focus hour. Yeah. So I've pulled back on that a little bit, focusing more on groups.
[00:27:27] Ashley Comegys: Is there an area that you have found more passionate or, this is what I wanna be focusing more on when it comes to additional income streams.
[00:27:38] Yeah, so
[00:27:39] Michelle Risser: CEUs has been one that's naturally kind of taken off because of the interest. So many people are interested in. Yeah, teaching CEUs and sharing what they know and what they're passionate about. And there is this perception and it's not entirely untrue that, that it's a difficult process. And I would say it's not a difficult [00:28:00] process, but it is a tedious process.
[00:28:02] Yeah. It's tedious. It's.
[00:28:08] And a lot of people feel really overwhelmed with that. So I love helping people with that. Just to navigate that. I am, as you said, I'm always passionate about burnout prevention, which is kind of how we met. Yeah. Was we participated in collaboration and realized we had this, so many areas of overlap. And, um, what's, what's interesting, I also provide coaching.
[00:28:31] I do a lot of different things. I like doing a lot of different things that keeps it fresh for me, but just. On this topic of what we're talking about with my, my daughter's changing needs and pulling back, I, I do some writing. I write for a website and I've actually increased the number of articles I'm writing and pulling back on the number of therapy clients I've allowed me to take on a couple more articles each month, and that helps offset the income.
[00:28:59] Yeah. So [00:29:00] even though I'm doing a lot more writing, I can do writing in my pajamas at the kitchen table. Yeah, I can do it out on my, on my patio. I can take a break and get the door. Yeah. Or go pick up my kid. You know? That's where that is really, I feel like there for me right now, the writing piece and also creating courses, things that don't, what they call asynchronous work, things that don't require me to be on an appointment.
[00:29:27] Sure. That's what I'm really leaning into right now.
[00:29:30] Ashley Comegys: Well, and the types of things that you're talking about allow you, like hypothetically, if you needed to be sitting at the softball field, putting together a presentation on your computer or even your phone, you could do that. Right. You can't really be holding a therapy session when they're having batting practice in the background.
[00:29:50] Right. That's exactly right. That you can be doing this other work's if
[00:29:54] Michelle Risser: you need to. I've written many an article from a softball field. Yeah. And um, as [00:30:00] far as this asynchronous work lately, something new that I've been doing with continuing education is I'm offering week of boxer. And if anybody doesn't know what Boxer is, it's a walkie-talkie app.
[00:30:11] And people will send me their materials and I'll review them and I will communicate with them back and forth over boxer. And I can do that from the softball field from. You know, from the front porch on a walk even I can just talk on, talk and share some thoughts so I'm not tied to my desk. Right. Which is wonderful, and I feel like I'm still helping people reach their goals.
[00:30:33] Ashley Comegys: Yeah. For me, I started venturing into additional income streams. It was very similar time as you, it was right? Mm-hmm. At the start, right before the pandemic hit, like. Fall of 2019, I was starting to look at it and then started in January of, of 2020, and it was for a similar need. It wasn't because necessarily of my family's schedule at that time, but because we're a military family, there are periods of time where [00:31:00] we have to move and theoretically I could hold a therapy session in a hotel room, but I may not have childcare or I may not have.
[00:31:11] Full internet access or something like that. And so it was this idea that, okay, if this is another way to supplement income for those periods of time when it's not as feasible for me to be seeing clients during moves and that kind of thing, or if my husband's away that that was a way to help supplement some of that.
[00:31:30] And I think it's interesting. Where I am now, like that need has is still exists as far as we will still move. My husband will still be away for trainings and that kind of thing, but. Right now, the additional income streams for me is similar to you. It's just my family needs are changing and the family dynamics are changing, and so it's going to have to be a matter of pulling back on some therapy clients leading up [00:32:00] to maternity leave, but also afterwards too.
[00:32:03] And so, yeah, having this additional income stream that. I've already started the ball rolling or is already built. It's interesting because I built it for one reason and now it's gonna help serve this other purpose for me and my family. And I think your story of cancer, you don't know when something's gonna happen that's gonna have to require you to pull back.
[00:32:27] Right.
[00:32:27] Michelle Risser: You weren't expect. Yeah. No. I went for my screening mammogram and got a call back, you know, almost right away. We need more pictures. And then I felt like my life had been thrown into a blender, you know? I'm sure. And, and it happened so fast, and it's like, oh my gosh, how do you deal with something like that and have a full therapy schedule?
[00:32:49] And, and I, I feel bad for my clients during that, that time because I am sure I was not present, but I didn't know what to do. I was just, oh my gosh. I was just [00:33:00] trying to push through.
[00:33:01] Ashley Comegys: Yeah, regardless of where you are, whether you have children or not, whether you are in a place where you wanna see 30 clients or you wanna see five a week, knowing that there are other options to help.
[00:33:14] Mm-hmm. Either supplement or replace your income, I think is just. It, it's smart in a way to just help. It's like extra protection. I know you actually have a workshop that's gonna be coming up to explore some of that for people. Can you share a little bit about that?
[00:33:32] Michelle Risser: Absolutely. So I am creating a workshop.
[00:33:35] Series with our dear mutual friend Jenny Hughes, who, yes. If anybody out there does not shout out to Jenny, we should, yes. Hi Jenny. Cause of conversations like this, we decided that we wanted to make diversifying your income streams accessible. And you know, a lot of the income streams are, are not that accessible because they do require a separate business and they require a large [00:34:00] investment upfront.
[00:34:01] So we wanted to just bring diversified income streams. To people who maybe don't have a ton of time, but people like us who need other ways to make income and to have impact too, you know, to have more impact. So our workshop series is going to teach people over four workshops. It's going to take you from the process of figuring out what you wanna do, and these are all income streams.
[00:34:26] So we're not gonna do coaching because ethically coaching really requires. A separate business. Sure. Um, but we'll do things that you can add to your existing therapy practice and you'll, everything from figuring out which one you're going to do to having it actually implemented, created. And I'll be teaching the workshops about how to actually do these things.
[00:34:48] And Jenny is going to be posting implementation sessions in between coworking sessions where she actually takes you through the process, helps you overcome any barriers. [00:35:00] There's also going to be a bonus about how to use AI to skyrocket your productivity. Sure. To use it ethically and safely and you know, to really get things done quick.
[00:35:11] In fact, I used AI just last night to help me write an email. It's still me. It's still me writing it. Yeah. But it just helps. It helps give you some ideas and yeah. And Jenny and I are offering this entire workshop series, so four one hour workshops, four implementation. Sessions for $97. That's a great deal.
[00:35:30] Which is, yeah, it's a fantastic deal if you've been in the online business world at all. You know that programs like that go for at least a grand, so, right. And I'm not just saying that we, we really consciously wanted this to be accessible. Yeah. To be, so the wait list is open for that. We'll be launching it at the end of June, which by the time this podcast comes out, quite the cart will be open.
[00:35:52] But for now, we have a wait list link and, uh,
[00:35:57] Ashley Comegys: Yeah, we'll have them come join us. Yeah, we'll have a [00:36:00] link in the show notes for the wait list. And I know you also have some free checklists for if you are interested in teaching CEUs. I've taken um, Michelle's CE course and it's definitely very, very helpful.
[00:36:14] You know, especially if you're looking to do it on your own and not necessarily. So like going through, you know, a larger agency, I'm all about having autonomy and having independence over your businesses and I think your program really does help set a lot of that up. So definitely recommend that.
[00:36:32] Michelle Risser: Thank you, and Ashley did an awesome bonus in my course that she's talking about that actually teaches you how to use Zoom to teach your life.
[00:36:43] Forgot that I did this. Yes, and even it's, it's really good. It's really informative. She shows you how to, you know, the nuts and bolts of, here's how you share your screen. Here's how you work the chat. Here's how you go into breakout rooms. So that's my diversify your income with CEUs course, which, like Ashley said, [00:37:00] it's very do it yourself step by step for somebody.
[00:37:03] But I do have a free checklist, um, that'll just give you an idea of what's involved with getting started with CEUs. Um, um, some people say ce, some say CEUs. I usually say CE EU because that's kind of a lay term that most people think of it as, but they're interchangeable. Yeah. And um, and then the other thing I have is I have my free Facebook group, the Burnout Proof Therapist Moms Group, which is just a wonderful, supportive community.
[00:37:30] Anybody who identifies as a mom and works as professions, It's just a, a great place for us to support each other. I think it's the best place on Facebook, myself,
[00:37:42] Ashley Comegys: and all of those links will be in the show notes for listeners to check out. Michelle, it always warms my soul when we get to chat, whether it's here or over Voxer or just, you know, venting and needing to decompress and support one another.
[00:37:56] I really appreciate you taking the time to share about where you are [00:38:00] with your journey and let listeners in a little bit on that. Absolutely.
[00:38:05] Michelle Risser: I'm so glad to be here and Ashley and I have a project coming up soon. Well, a, a workshop coming up soon and her membership. And, um, if you're in Ashley's world, you'll be seeing me around.
[00:38:16] Ashley Comegys: Michelle is gonna be presenting in our village community, and it's going to be going through the CEU checklist and looking at how do we set ourselves up for the beginning stages of getting all the stuff together so that you can present your c u and get it approved. So yes, check that out in the village community if you're already there or you can join us to watch the replay.
[00:38:37] Excited. Thanks again so much, Michelle. And I know again, this won't be the last that we hear of you on the show.
[00:38:43] Michelle Risser: Thank you, Ashley. Thanks so much for having me on.
[00:38:47] Ashley Comegys: Thank you so much for listening to the Raise to Empower podcast. Check the show notes for all links and resources mentioned in the show. If you found today's episode helpful or inspiring, be sure to share it with your therapist [00:39:00] friends, and don't forget to subscribe to the show and leave your five star rating and review.
[00:39:04] It truly means so much to me and will help us get our message of empowerment out to other women and mom clinicians, and I'd love to connect with you in our Facebook community. So check out the show notes for the link or head to Bitly slash raised to empower to join us. I'll see you back here next week.